Exploring the Epic of 'Lord of the Rings: The Two Towers': Insights and Revelations ep187

0:00ShareSo, tom, tell me more about body, hair, what we can't hold, but sloth them, hold them , hold them. I want you to eat as long as you can get me. You can't hold back the podcast . I don't know why, but I recorded stuff from HBO and anything you record from them. They've altered their stuff, but when you record it it sounds like the perfect collaboration.

0:38ShareTom:That's probably why because they don't want us using it on our dinky podcast.

0:45ShareI didn't know that until I recorded the stuff and I went to go edit it and I was like what's wrong with this thing?

0:49ShareTom:I should have just did it off of YouTube.

0:50ShareYeah, I will next time.

0:52ShareTom:Anyway, welcome to Intertain this. It's a podcast about movies, tv shows and video games. My name is Tom. With me I have Mitch and who, who, who, who, who, who, who, who, who, who, who, who, you, you, the listener. You're standing in as our third .

1:10ShareYeah, sure, why not?

1:11ShareTom:Because Hayden's not here. How are we doing in downloads in Germany?

1:15ShareActually I don't know about Germany. I was going to say, in all, this is probably our best January so far.

1:20ShareTom:Out of 4 January's. We're only going up.

1:24ShareWe're moving up and you know it's nice of Hayden not to be here, so we get good downloads.

1:30ShareTom:That's the reason it's really going up. It's like, oh, they finally got rid of it. We can enjoy this show.

1:36ShareYeah, we're not far from beating our record as far as like per month.

1:42ShareTom:So what's our record?

1:43ShareWell, it's pretty high.

1:45ShareTom:It's pretty high. It's like millions. It's big, it's huge. There's a lot of numbers, it's huge. This podcast is tremendous. I remember listening and I thought wow, these guys are tremendous.

1:55ShareAnyways, our social media is well, our social media is entertainthispodcastcom, which will take you to our Facebook group and page. You also go to our Twitter, which is at this entertain our Instagram, which is entertainthis. We also have our YouTube and TikTok, which entertain this exclamation point we also have our threads, which is entertainthis, so you can check us out there or anywhere. But, hey, if you're listening, we need more subscribers. So you know, if you're at the red light, roll down your window , yell at the guy next to you, tell him hey, entertain this, listen to this podcast. If you're sitting on the subway going down the tracks, whatever , look to your guy. The subway, yes, there's only one.

2:36ShareTom:If you're ordering a sandwich, tell the people making it, no, the actual subway.

2:39ShareYou're like in New York If you're sitting next to somebody on the subway, look to your right and left, tell them we need more listeners, have them follow us on social media, instagram, any of that stuff. So we need more people. The more people the better.

2:54ShareTom:I'm just laughing like you are an idiot, I mean at least we're not like scam, calling people like hey, you like podcasts, we could.

3:06ShareWe write that down.

3:08ShareTom:If you get a phone call, it's like hey, check out this podcast. Click.

3:12ShareUnsolicited advice. Check this out.

3:15ShareTom:This episode we're doing the two towers.

3:17ShareYes.

3:19ShareTom:The continuation of this Lord of the Rings thing that you came up with, which, granted, I took no convincing it's not a porn parody with two towers. I didn't look up. Is that a thing? And I'm like, probably a thing, I don't want to look it up, that's probably it. They don't look that up. I mean, I typed in the two towers and immediately Lord of the Rings popped up and it was the movie. Okay, the 20, sorry, the 2002, 22 years ago film, the second part of the trilogy following fellowship of the ring. Yes, we pick back up with Frodo and the gang.

3:53ShareWell, separately, yes , separately.

3:56ShareTom:This is the first time where you have the Virgin storylines happening at once. The book does it entirely different. Oh yeah. The because all the other books , it's six books. Books one and two is fellowship to three and four is two towers .

4:09ShareOh, six, I thought it was three books.

4:12ShareTom:It's, there's three books. It's the fellowship of the ring , but it's broken down the two books. So you got book because I think it was released in six book installments. Okay, initially back in the 50s when Tolkien released it. But two towers, book three of the two towers is the beginning part of it, which is all Aragorn , legolas and Gimli. Okay, the very end of, well, the very first chapter is the breaking of the fellowship and departure of Baramir. So you go through the whole battle of Aamon Hen, baramir's death, the decision to you know, frodo goes and then you get like counter ones, where it like it's a lot of Aragorn and then some of it's also Mary and Pippin. Okay, and then you get to book.

5:00ShareTom:Four is when you have what happens with Frodo and Sam and then golem. Well, because I know in the movie it starts off with the Balrog and Gandalf. Yeah it starts off with you see that, because that was I hadn't read the book. At this point. That's wrong. I did. I'd seen fellowship first. I had not read any of the books . Gandalf dying was like everyone in the theater who had not read the book or didn't know was like devastated. A girl I was dating I remember showing her the movie years later and like we're sitting there watching the movie, she was like are there a lot of people who are watching the movie? She was like I don't want to watch this stupid movie. And I was like I went to the movies like three times to watch

5:47ShareTom:your dumb chick flick movies. You owe me one.

5:49ShareAnd it was fellowship .

5:51ShareTom:I'm going to convince my wife to watch season when Gandalf was like about to go down, like literally, like she grabbed my arms and like clenched she's like, don't tell me, this guy died. She was like don't tell me she was, like she was so enthralled Like it's like, yeah, it happens to everybody. It happens to everybody.

6:06ShareWell, my question is how long were they fighting? Because they basically fell to like the center of the earth and then they're fighting at the top of mountain in the movie the highest mountain, like in Arda or well, I don't know about Arda , but at least Middle Earth.

6:22ShareTom:So it does open with that. You see, you know, you're getting like different views of it happening. Gandalf falls and then it's awesome because he's falling into sword, like it's like, and he catches it, it's like, and he just starts going crazy and everybody in the theater is like , wow, like get him.

6:37ShareWell, I like to like. At one point in the fight he like raises it up, gets lightning and well, that happens later, well, yeah.

6:42ShareTom:In the movie, but that in the fight, yes, it does. But he, they crash land into the lake at the bottom, like the very bottom of like everything, it's like like the foundations of the earth, I think is what they call it. And then Frodo wakes up and he's like oh, gandalf.

6:59ShareOh yeah, that's right , Because yeah, flash yeah.

7:02ShareTom:So we go through Frodo and Samra lost, so they're being stalked by Gollum, and then they eventually capture Gollum. They can tell he's coming because of his smell his smell and the fact he's talking out loud yeah. While he's like three feet from him and it's like dude, like stealth, stealthy.

7:21ShareNot a strong point.

7:23ShareTom:You're not. You're not talking to yourself like you're not internalizing it , you're externalizing it. Everyone in the everyone a mile away probably hears you, smigel . They jump golem, get the drop on him and take him captive with the elven rope, which burns him because of the ring.

7:40ShareI was like why did that burn him? But?

7:42ShareTom:so having the ring for so long, like he kind of like, takes on a lot of the evil personas. Yeah, because it basically splits his personality where he's had it for so long. He's got him and Smigel and this movie. You see more of the Smigel golem dynamic later when he breaks from it for a little while, where he becomes Smigel mostly again until the end of the movie. Yeah. But you go through that. I mean they get lost in a wheel and then they find, get, find golem. Golem gets him out of a wheel and on the way into good, getting to Mordor, which at this point there at the map, because Aiman and I say go through La Thorin and they go through Barma , goes over the Falls of Raros, they cross the river, they go

8:30ShareTom:down, I think they co, they end up in the movie Going through like this huge range. They bypass Rohan and end up like near a Thillion in Eastern Gondor, having to refer to the map, and then we cut from them for a while. We get back to Aragorn, which everybody wanted to see, because Aragorn is the coolest person in the world of the Rings Change my mind and he's like literally they cuts to him. It looks like he's sleeping but he's listening to the ground and it's just like it's like their pace is quickening Because he's, you know, super Ranger sense. He's rolling like plus 20. And it's like you know the pace was like you know. It's like they know we're following them.

9:18ShareYeah, well, yeah, because they're carrying.

9:21ShareTom:Mary and Pippin. They go, like, like they go an absurd distance running day and night.

9:30ShareThe three, or yeah, okay.

9:33ShareTom:The three hunters is what it's referred to in the book I have a question, the orcs .

9:37Sharehow do they not realize that Mary and Pippin are not the ones they're looking for, because they don't know. They don't have the ring.

9:43ShareTom:They didn't search them Because, in fellowship, sarah Montels Sarah Montels Lertz, who's in charge of all of them you know, one of the one of the halflings is carrying something greatly important like bringing them alive and unspoiled.

9:56ShareBut they don't know. The orc's know. There's four of them and the orcs know that the orcs didn't search them.

10:01ShareTom:I mean they took their weapons or whatever, but like they didn't physically go through all their pockets and rummage around looking for the ring, Because even in the books they're like one of them is carrying something, some elvish plot for the war, like the master wants it.

10:15ShareOkay.

10:16ShareTom:Like they know, for a reason, don't touch them, don't search them, just get them to Isildar.

10:20ShareSo they just know that they have something that's that's important, he wants it.

10:23ShareTom:Bring it to him. Okay, that's their whole to do.

10:27ShareWell, I was wondering , like how did they just not figure this out? But yeah, okay, that makes sense. So they didn't know what it was , they just knew they had to bring him. Okay, just wondering.

10:34ShareTom:So then we cut with the Uruk high, marion Pippen or you know like, hung around like backpacks while the orcs are running, and then they meet the. They meet orcs from Mordor.

10:47ShareOh yeah.

10:48ShareTom:And there's kind of there's a little, you know a bit , of a pissing contest and the orc high, who are much bigger, are like we're going to Isengard . We, we and like all of them have, like the white, you know hand of Sauron or Saruman on their armor or shields. And it's like you know, we follow the white wizard, like we're going to Isengard and like they were, because the Uruk high could run in sunlight.

11:09ShareYes.

11:10ShareTom:The orcs could, but it was like distressing in a way to him. And then you have like Saruman, like using like magic to like sway them to run faster and like not be burdened or tire.

11:23ShareYou also have Saruman , who has the, who are the men that pledged to him and then attack the village.

11:30ShareTom:The wildlings.

11:31ShareOh, they're just a group of men, that's bad.

11:34ShareTom:Okay, so they're originally part of what Rohan was Okay. Before the formation of Rohan and the wars between Gondor and, I believe, the Easterlings and then towards Rune. If you look at the map, like all because Rohan became a satellite kind of group for Gondor became it's okay to but all this disputed stuff here Like people from the East would come in and raid because all this used to be Gondor.

12:05ShareGotcha.

12:06ShareTom:Okay, well, I pointed the map that you can't see Visual aids. That's when, rohan, because they pled, or they pledged to Gondor, like in time of need, like we'll back each other up.

12:19ShareWell then, after that it kind of shows you Yermir, your how do you say his name? Aymir, and the writers of Rohan , and like I know they're the king of Rohan, they're his son.

12:32ShareTom:No, aymir's, not his son. Oh, he's not Aymir's, his nephew.

12:34ShareOkay, well, like, what's so special about him and the writers of Rohan, like they tell them as their speciality?

12:39ShareTom:They're legendary cavalry. Okay, like they are renowned for their horses, like then the ring rates horses came from Rohan.

12:47ShareOkay, well, because I thought they taught them as like these, this big powerful force, but you know, you don't really know a whole lot about them. So at least in the movie.

12:55ShareTom:In the books they get more where it's like they're. It's like they're wise but unlearned, Like everyone grows, like this whole thing, Like they don't write anything down but they sing them any songs about the exploits of former kings and great warriors in Rohan. Okay. They're more like a I don't want to say a Viking group, but their their style is is like Norse.

13:17ShareOkay.

13:18ShareTom:But they're not like Vikings, you know, pillaging and raping away across the fields.

13:22ShareYeah, they just they go through and destroy any evil they come across pretty much.

13:26ShareTom:They protect the Eastern borders of Gondor.

13:28ShareOkay, and then the next part, that you see a Theoden who's like under the spell. How does he get under the spell ?

13:34ShareTom:Front, so it seems like he's poisoned.

13:39ShareOkay, from, I guess from from Grima, warm tongue.

13:42ShareTom:Slowly been poisoning like whittling. In the movie it's more pronounced looking. Yeah. In the books it's kind of vague Like he like when they meet him he's like a wizened old man, like bent like an old tree, like in storms, okay, and then like when Gandalf like purges him of like the poison and like of Sauriman's influence, like he kind of. He's like he's in the books, he's like 70 years old.

14:04ShareOkay, his hair is white Like he's in.

14:06ShareTom:he's an older, older guy. What's I was going to say? Like in the movie he's like probably like he looks like he's in his mid fifties.

14:11ShareWell, because he's a good guy, but then he's already been like corrupted, so I was just wondering how that came about. So it was just like a servant guy.

14:17ShareTom:That was over agreement, that which was over an extended amount of time Okay.

14:21ShareI was just wondering cause like it didn't really explain that a whole lot in the movie there's a lot I mean two towers has a lot going on, cause , even like, when they meet, I am here.

14:35ShareTom:No, nevermind, I'm wrong. There's a lot going on because, uh, a year mere scenes are kind of different, because they meet a mirror initially in the writers of Rohan, whereas by the time they get to Eduras, a mirror had been imprisoned.

14:51ShareOkay, yeah, that never happens in the movie.

14:52ShareTom:Because in the extended cut it does Well, they banish him. Yeah, they show that part where it's like you've been in like the King's side and it's like the one good letter. And then it was like oh, he just drove. He fell asleep while he's riding it. He's imprisoned. Okay, when they show up.

15:10ShareGotcha.

15:12ShareTom:So, yeah, the orcs are, urechai are running, mary or no? Pippin has the brilliant idea to bite the Elven brooch off of his cloak and spit it to the ground.

15:24ShareYeah, that way as a token that they were there and they were still alive.

15:28ShareTom:Yeah, ergon eventually finds it, realizes that they're closing on him and they continue to go in the night . They stop and rest because they lose the trail because of darkness. So they stop, they meet air mirror.

15:42Sharethe next no not yet.

15:43ShareTom:They meet a mirror after the fat during the night, the Roheir, and find the Urechai slaughter, all the Urechai.

15:50ShareThat's when you have like the same. They're like why don't we eat them?

15:54ShareTom:They're fresh. Yeah, meets back on the menu, boys, like you, guys had menus.

16:01ShareI just like the fact that they're like no, they're not for eating, they weren't. That's pretty funny though.

16:09ShareTom:So they do that. Pippin fakes out the orc, that Grishnak is what he's called, the one who chases them in the Fangorn forest, that they like. He starts like acting kind of like golem and the orc so like, ooh, that's what you got, you got the ring. So he ends up grabbing them and taking them into the forest when the Roheir attack, and on their way he like literally like he's running with both of them under their arms and then it's just like horse and he drops them. They fight and then the two of them escape and run off in the Fangorn and then he tracks them after the fact. Okay, but then, but all the Urca get wiped out like immediately.

16:47ShareWell, in the movie it doesn't happen that way, though , because they just they run in, and then he's following them and then steps on it.

16:53ShareTom:Yeah, tree beard school.

16:55ShareAnd I'll say don't know where at this point, where, like the, the Rohan riders, they've killed all the orcs and the Marion Pippin have run into the forest.

17:05ShareTom:Yeah, Aragorn and Aremir meet.

17:07ShareI mean how the ince just live there, that's okay. How long have they been there?

17:11ShareTom:Because they act like they are since, like the first stage, Okay, because they act like they're millions of years old. They've been there since probably before the first stage.

17:19ShareOkay, okay, I just wonder. Like I said, it's stuff that's not completely explained in the movie, and I've never read the books yet, so I mean two towers is.

17:28ShareTom:Plot is linear but there's a lot going on, but a lot of it is just travel of getting from point A. It's all the build up into the first major battle in the War of the Ring. Okay, Alive is just like parties meeting and you know, doing all the introductions and then getting to towards the final showdowns. Okay. So Aragorn finds the battle man realizes the hobbits were still alive and they escaped into Fangorn. They end up camping on the edge of Fangorn and they meet. It's in the book. They see, like this old man, like great cloaked and all that like kind of like out of, almost out of the light of the fire. Yeah. At the end and like Gimli's, like on Garty wakes up Aragorn. Aragorn's like oh you know, warm yourself by the fire,

18:17ShareTom:stranger. And then they look in the dude just disappeared and all their horses were gone too. And it turns out later that it was Saruman. They saw. They don't show that, and they did film it for the movie.

18:31ShareOh, they did Okay.

18:32ShareTom:I've seen it. They didn't put in the extended cut.

18:35ShareWell, six, eight because airmare gives them horses and then, when they go into the woods, there's no horses with them anymore.

18:40ShareTom:Yeah, that's what. That's why there's no horses.

18:43ShareAnd then that makes sense. On why they assume that when Gandalf shows up at Saruman again, because it's they've already met him once.

18:49ShareTom:Exactly that makes more sense, then Exactly they should have left that in there, it wouldn't have tied it all together nicely. Yeah, mitch would not have been confused. So Aragorn and Gimli and Legolas enter Fangorn following the tracks and Aragorn is like these are very. No one had seen ends in probably a very long time. Yeah, the answer. Familiar with Saruman Well yeah , because they were gonna be used to walk through the forest. Yeah, you know, before he was corrupted fully, so they didn't really tell them. That's when Aragorn, legolas and Gimli see the white wizard approaching, who they think was Saruman, but turns out to be Gandalf.

19:30ShareI do like how Gandalf all three of them get ready to attack. He just like, waves his staff and destroys everything they send in. And superheats Aragorn sword yeah all in the span of like three seconds. Yeah, in the book.

19:43ShareTom:It's kind of like it's similar, okay, how it kind of all happens. It's very similar.

19:49ShareSo I do like the strategy, like I mean, it made sense. He's like, you know, don't let him say anything because they were all planning even though it didn't work.

19:55ShareTom:I caught him lacking.

20:00ShareBut then after the after they talk about or they meet Gandalf again, it kind of flashes over to Sam Frodo and golem or smegel starting to traverse the marsh.

20:13ShareTom:Yeah, they go through the dead marshes.

20:14ShareWhat is the dead? Marshes the dead.

20:16ShareTom:Marth marshes is what's outside. It's called the Morana. It's outside the black gate.

20:21ShareWell, I mean how? Why so the?

20:22ShareTom:that happened during the last alliance of men and elves, when they fought sound Ron.

20:30ShareOkay, so that was in the second age.

20:31ShareTom:Yeah, that army broke rank and got trapped.

20:35ShareOkay.

20:36ShareTom:And they all died. All the orcs, all the elves, even dwarves men died there and eventually the land just became flooded and like well, how are they?

20:45Sharelike ghosts and stuff , it's the dead marshes, I mean, that's just.

20:49ShareTom:I don't know, they don't really explain it. They don't explain that. I was like how?

20:53Shareare there ghosts there? And then how are they so well preserved bodies in the water?

20:56ShareTom:Okay, elves don't decompose quickly, there's just questions I have after watching the movie. It's like don't follow the lights. It's kind of like it's a haunted, like sentient sort of area.

21:14ShareOkay.

21:14ShareTom:And in the book, like the Lord of the Rings, the BBC drama one, the live one that you can find, recommend it, love it . If you're on a long car trip, pop those discs in. It's kind of cheesy, it really is, but it's very, very, very faithful to the books. Okay, and it's like word for word dialogue from the books, but like the narrator when he talks about, like when they see the dead marshes and like describing it, it's like you want to throw up.

21:42ShareI was wondering, because I didn't really explain how all these people are just dead in this spot, so I wasn't sure.

21:49ShareTom:So Marion Pippin. Then, as they escape from the or they get captured by Tree Beard, who thinks their orcs because, they'd never seen hobbits. They eventually kind of sway him that they're just hobbits, they're not orcs, they don't look like orcs, you know. He kind of goes back and forth with them a little bit, but he takes him like his house, which is like a big rock, like his bed , like he is, and he was like you know, oh, we're gonna go to sleep, and he's like where are you guys gonna stand? And they're like we lay down, lay down.

22:20ShareNovel idea.

22:22ShareTom:Weird, I'm gonna stand out here.

22:27ShareWell then, was it the two of them. They go in there and they find the special spring in the forest Marion Pippin.

22:35ShareTom:Yeah, they start in this standard vision. They start drinking from it and Pippin starts getting taller.

22:39ShareDo they actually get taller? They just think they are yeah.

22:41ShareTom:No, no, they actually start getting taller.

22:43ShareOkay, I was wondering .

22:44ShareTom:The water light is super fulfilling because it feeds the ends.

22:48ShareWell, I heard him say in the movie that that's why the inscrew tall and heavy or sentient and all that.

22:53ShareTom:So they started and they got taller because it was like the water was so it was like enough of it, was enough substance in it. We're like they didn't need to eat.

23:00ShareOkay, well, because, like you see, marion Pippin, like like judging each other's height.

23:04ShareTom:And it's like I've been tall to new for like 20 years and he's just like he drinks and he like burps and he gets a little taller. He's like, oh see, like I'll talk, can I be?

23:14ShareBut also while Proto and Sam and Smeagol are going through the four or the marshes, they see the ring race. Have they been at the ring race like throughout the entire movie? Are they like searching for them?

23:27ShareTom:At this point, no, okay, they start surrounding the borders, because at this point Sauron is getting ready for like war.

23:35ShareOkay, well cause?

23:36ShareTom:I was wondering because, like the, because at this point they don't know where Frodo is.

23:39ShareOkay, well, because you in the first movie they're like hot on his trail and then from here on out you kind of see him sparsely until the you know , the witch king shows up.

23:46ShareTom:Yeah, they start going around the borders because , since they all okay he sent the nine of them out. They found them, they stabbed them, then they just left. Well, I mean they had to go, and then they all got taken out by the river. Yeah, on the borders of Rivenbell.

24:01ShareI wasn't sure if they were still searching for him the whole time or what so.

24:04ShareTom:I mean they were kind of sick because he figured that they were going to be coming closer to Gondor, so that's why he had him out there and plus, he was already at war with Gondor this entire time.

24:13ShareAnd then also when, uh, uh, what's it? Uh, airborne, legolas and Gimli , they, they goes over to their scene where they're starting to talk to Gandalf.

24:23ShareTom:And he tells them what happened. Well, how?

24:25Sharehow does he not like? Was he? Was he confused on who he is?

24:29ShareTom:So that's another thing that people bring up, like you know, because it was like, why didn't they just fly to Mordor and just like, do like a bombing, run and drop the ring in the volcano?

24:39ShareWell, I heard that like they were out fighting somewhere else the Eagles and stuff.

24:44ShareTom:So the Eagles also. It's just a clever plot, convenience, because the Eagles like, because they explain, like in the books and like you know Tolgian's notes, it's like the Eagles weren't just going to fly over Mordor. Like that's like a death sentence. It's like not with God knows what's going on over there. Yeah, Like they got dragons flying around, they got the Felbees, thousands upon thousands of archers, all kinds of devices, Sauron, yeah, Kind of like. Yeah, we're not doing that, that's Balzy, that's that's silly. But again I was like. I mean, it was like when people the whole like thing, where again I was like fly you fools, was like the head to like go find the Eagles, fly as far as closest you can get and then

25:25ShareTom:disembarking, either go on foot or see if they'll even take you over it. But again, those memory loss. He forgot that that was part of the plan. Just conveniently forgot because he quickly like re-established, because, I mean, he did die, so he had to like recess. You know, he's basically reincarnated and gelically brought back.

25:41ShareOkay.

25:43ShareTom:Because he wakes up like buck, naked where he was, and the Eagles find him, bring him to Laflorion, where he gets reclothed and given a new staff.

25:53ShareOkay so, but he's turned into the white wizard. I mean what they just saw him on some.

25:59ShareTom:Yeah, they took the title from Salman. Okay, so I'm on. The white Gandalf was Gandalf the gray Gandalf was originally going to be the brown, but he got elevated to gray.

26:08ShareOkay, what a hierarchy of color.

26:11ShareTom:Well, yeah, white, gray, brown, blue.

26:14ShareBlue sounds better.

26:16ShareTom:Blue is low.

26:18ShareOh well, and then, when they get ready to leave the woods with Gandalf, how does Legolas know who his horse is?

26:27ShareTom:Probably because elves can see like.

26:31ShareHe knew the horse by name.

26:34ShareTom:No, he didn't know the horse by by name. Gandalf said who it was. It was Shadowfax, which was the king's horse, and when Gandalf used Shadowfax the first time, shadowfax wouldn't let anyone else ride him, including King Thayden. So they were all kind of. Rohan was kind of pissed off at him because he took Shadowfax, who was, like you know, the G of all horses, and was kind of like a Myar sort of angelic.

26:59ShareWell, I was wondering he whistles and it just shows up. So I didn't know how it just appears.

27:06ShareTom:He's kind of. He's kind of like a Myar sort of figure Shadowfax, which is a cool name for a horse and a cat.

27:14ShareAnd then also Gandalf talks about Sauron fearing Aragorn.

27:20ShareTom:Yeah.

27:20ShareWhy.

27:21ShareTom:Because, for all intents and purpose, they thought the line was broken. It was over. But I mean the last king of Gondor died in Minas Morgul. But why would he accept a? Challenge to a one-on-one duel to the Witch King of Angmar and he left his crown on the Stuart's chair without issue or without children, wasn't married and went and was never seen again.

27:43ShareBut I mean, but why would he fear him?

27:44ShareTom:because Because he could unite Everybody was like.

27:48ShareI mean because his ancestor, a sildur, is the one that got corrupted and Ran off of the work ring to begin with but Sauron.

27:54ShareTom:Sauron had for this entire time, for like the two thousand two and a half thousand years of the second third age, like he didn't have to contend with Someone who had the lineage to unite to reform Arnor and Gondor and reclaim the throne.

28:11ShareI was wondering like why would he fear Aragorn particularly so?

28:15ShareTom:And Eragorn also had like the blood of new Menor still. Which is why? Because in the book, in the movie and in the books he's 87 years old when this is happening .

28:22ShareI mean I know he technically ages slower physically, but I mean I didn't know plus.

28:27ShareTom:Eragorn the. You know there's like always, you know, the air of a sildur and more like a lend deal than anyone else before him. Okay and then Len deals, the one who tag teams with Gilgill had to take Sauron down. The beginning takes down on colligan the black. No, no, no, that was this. No, that was a rendio.

28:44ShareOh, sorry, my bad, I rendeal not Ellen, yeah a lot of similar names.

28:51ShareTom:But Eragorn had already fought. He knew fading when fading was a little kid.

28:55ShareYeah, I remember, cuz I remember him saying that in the movie and then the girls like surprised he's like the air going had served in Rohan and in Gondor under the name Tharring Gil, which is like Right star or something he had.

29:09ShareTom:he had a cool name. Okay but he had like attacked the courses of umbar with Gondor Like he'd fought so I'm like the kings of stuff. He was already well-known, he had like 60 plus years of battle experience with Rohan and Gondor. Okay, leading like he was a captain of men. That's why he's a leader and that's why I also stayed is kind of like you. He's like you look. So Huh, because even when he's talking to a when issues, he's like you know, it's like he's like Mike, she's like he told me it's crazy, he wrote a war with his father, dangle, and he's like he's like. He's like he has a good memory. He goes. He's only a small boy at the time.

29:49ShareWell, that part is where you know he's fine, he still has.

29:52ShareTom:He has the long life of new manure.

29:53ShareYeah, that fix it. The was it. What's the girl's name? I forget a woman, she.

29:59ShareTom:Yeah yeah she figures out that he's older, like well, he explains to her and then she's like guessing, like Seventy's, like you can't be a those, maybe seven.

30:08ShareI like the whole part where she gives him.

30:11ShareTom:That's like not cooked and he's like he like burns his hand trying to throw it off.

30:18ShareBut then they get attacked by the we're going off track a little bit. We're jumping ahead.

30:23ShareTom:Okay, um, gandalf explains the fight, which is cool, where he, like you know, fighting the bow rug on top of like Zaraan gale or whatever it's called, sore, gets struck by lightning, stabs the bow rug, yeah, dies. He's even like burned, frozen to death, almost even fighting for days, no food, no, nothing, kos, and then he's sent he's. This was like the one time we're like a Louvitar, like directly intervened and like Tens of thousands of years.

30:56ShareWhat would he do? Oh, sent the lightning, or what no?

30:58ShareTom:he restored Gandalf. Because, Gandalf still was the only one who held true to his purpose.

31:03ShareYeah, he still, he still had the.

31:05ShareTom:Valar sent him back like. Like you, you're not coming back until you're done. Okay, you need to get back out there, champ. It's like put him back in the game, coach. Like he pulled like a jack young blood. Like he got his leg broke in the NFC championship game, went to the training room, got it taped up, went back out, played, played in the Super Bowl and the Pro Bowl. Gandalf built different Okay. And then he leads them to Ed Harris, the capital of Rowan. Okay, yeah, yeah where they meet fade in Legos, gimli and Legos beat the crap out of all of Grima's.

31:43ShareWell, I like you're supposed to take the staff. You wouldn't rob an old man of his staff.

31:48ShareTom:Hey, like he like gets me like wings out, I'm like yeah.

31:51ShareI Like that. Don't take an old man's walking stick. It's like oh.

31:57ShareTom:And then he restores fade in, and then he brings their release.

32:03ShareHey, Amir what I do, like how he's like he's still got the gray cloak on. He's like you have no power here.

32:10ShareTom:Gandalf the great, he's like, like to me, just like . Oh, like it goes like fly through everybody's like.

32:16ShareWho I like, how King theaters is like.

32:23ShareTom:I was expecting that his eyes get.

32:24ShareWhy that's?

32:25ShareTom:like uno plus four.

32:27ShareAnd it's our minds like somebody hit him in the chair with us, with the still art in the face of the still chair.

32:31ShareTom:Yeah he's got like the staff mark across his face.

32:36ShareI love that scene so cool. It is nice to see that. You know. Gandalf has a little more power and he he comes back leveled up .

32:45ShareTom:Yeah, they let him backhand ceremony based on what they let him flex more yeah of his, of his inherent powers.

32:51ShareWhich I like that. I like to see him in his true power.

32:54ShareTom:So then, eventually, you, finally, you know Saruman and like the wildling or the Hillman, whatever they were called, are running amok the oryx, or raiding. They killed his son. Yeah they killed Thadred, who had died like he was alive for a good bit into the book.

33:11ShareOkay, and.

33:12ShareTom:I mean, he had died before Gandalf, like you know, broke him of Saruman, of Saruman's hold. Okay and then we got to go through the funeral scene and a one's horrible singing in the movie which was like why? Why do we let this one? We could have all did without this. She is not good at saying I'm sorry, miranda, I don't you, just you're not good at it.

33:36ShareAnd if so, that's after that happens. That's when they get ready to leave.

33:41ShareTom:They go, they empty at her as to make for Helm's Deep yeah, and it's on their journey from.

33:48ShareThere is where they get attacked.

33:50ShareTom:Yes, that's when they get attacked by the wargs. Okay from Isengard and they are going goes tumbling off. He almost died in real life when they did that.

33:59ShareWhy was that?

34:00ShareTom:where he's doing like the river thing, where he's floating after he falls. Like he got trapped under rocks . He almost drowned, geez. He had to like fight current in the rock and like he was, like he was touching gala, he was passing out and he managed to get himself out like he got. He got got beat up in this one he almost stabbed, he broke two toes. When he kicks the Uruk-hai's helmet because, like they did the scene like 30 times and Peter Jackson was like we're not just getting like the emotion, it's like you do one more and he's like I'll do another one. And they do it, and he just kicks these, like I just kicked crap out of that helmet, like it was a football Boom. I felt both my toes crack and I was like Ah, it hurts so much.

34:39ShareTom:He's like I just dropped my knee and they're like yeah that was it, and he's like cool, my toes broke.

34:49ShareBecause that. And then in the first movie you almost get stabbed when the person throws the knife at him.

34:54ShareTom:Orlando Bloom broke like, cracked like three ribs, or he broke, he creed, broke, or cracked like a couple of ribs doing this one too.

35:01ShareThat's what I was going to say.

35:02ShareTom:Researching this, I found out that he broke the injuries were real, like the insurance company was like ready to shut down. It's like someone's gonna die.

35:14ShareAnd then so at this point, that's where he falls off the cliff, and they all assume that he's dead.

35:19ShareTom:They, they think he's dead, even though it's like, don't, don't count down the main G of this entire posse. Let's be real if him and Gandalf fought my money's on Aragorn. Why. He's awesome, he's awesome, he's awesome. He's like he's literally the perfect dude.

35:37ShareGandalf did just disarm him in matter of two seconds. Yeah, but if you gave Aragorn that power, well, if, yeah, if you give him the power. He didn't have that power though.

35:45ShareTom:Did you imagine if he had a morpher Death and destruction.

35:51ShareI did find a power rangers theme opening with set to Lord of the Rings where they pop up.

35:57ShareTom:Is it Zia version or?

35:58ShareI don't remember. I think it was just mighty morphin, but it's as it's playing, the mighty morphin song .

36:04ShareTom:It's sour climbing out of like the dumpster.

36:06ShareIt's like a thousand years.

36:08ShareTom:I'm free time to conquer middle earth. I Watch that.

36:13ShareOh, it's pretty cool.

36:16ShareTom:I Watch that. So yet they go through. They make it To Eteros because they find, because they. The defense of Eteros would have been a horrible nightmare Because it's mostly made of wood . They could have been burned alive. So they go to Helm's deep, built by Helm Hammerhand, the once king of Rohan, with the help of giants. Yeah. They find when they get to the fortress is actually well defended, with many men Not like they get there and it's like oh crap, or screw it, because there's like none of us In the books. There's more of a defense.

36:49ShareI was excited because when they get there in the movie that's not a whole lot of defense.

36:52ShareTom:Because when they're making it to the fortress like there's a dyke that's in front that they find. Like by the time they get there there's enough men at arms to defend the dyke and Helms Deep. Okay. So there's more of a chance, like it's not. It doesn't. It's desperate, but it doesn't seem as desperate as it did in the movie.

37:09ShareYeah, well, they're arm and old men and children.

37:11ShareTom:I mean, yeah, I kind of have us too, but like there's enough of the boys to, like you know, get the job done because like they're retreating and airmen is with them this entire time. So the whole bit at the end, that's actually a different character entirely. Who's has like a thousand men at arms? Who's out there? He's the third Marshal of the Rittermark. Okay, that's Erkan brand. Who's out there? They eventually make it into Helms Deep. You know, they have enough men to secure the dyke, secure the wall, and they bring, like, all these people in and get ready to defend the fortress.

37:44ShareWell, at the same time.

37:45ShareTom:That's when Sam that's when they get to the Black Gate.

37:48ShareWell, I was like who are the men that are marching into the Black Gate?

37:51ShareTom:Those, are the Easterlings.

37:53ShareAnd I mean they're just a city or a what's it called. They're a group. Let me look at them, Me up. But they're just off to the east of Gondor, out there somewhere.

38:03ShareTom:Yeah, because the guy , the cool dudes in the Return of the King with the elephants, they're from Herod.

38:11ShareOkay.

38:12ShareTom:These guys might have been from Gond or Rune. I think they're from Rune.

38:16ShareWell, you see the elephants at one point, when Faramir yeah, you see them.

38:19ShareTom:Later, after Fredo and Sam, they try to the Black Gate. So they try, they get to the Black Gate of Mordor and that's when you got, like the company coming in, it's like, oh, sauron summoning all the evil men no, these are people, because Sauron had spent a significant amount of time there over two ages and had a lot of influence over there to summon them for his armies.

38:40ShareI just have to ask what made Frodo think that it was going to work to run through the gate that everybody's looking at?

38:46ShareTom:At this point, frodo's greatest counselors were gone. Ergon Gandalf not there. He was just. He's plain reckless. We're just going to run through the Black Gate and Sam's like I don't think these are even going to help us in there.

38:59ShareWell, I mean it's just one door that everyone's looking at, followed by an army that you're running behind.

39:05ShareTom:And, ironically, the Black Gates were built by Gondor .

39:08ShareOh yeah, they were supposed to keep the others out.

39:11ShareTom:Yeah, they're supposed to keep everything contained into Mordor.

39:14ShareAh well, so much for that Now to block everyone from getting into Mordor.

39:18ShareTom:Because they? Because Minas Morgul was Minas Ethel, which was built by Gondor as a watchtower. That, and the watchtower later when Frodo gets captured that was built by Gondor. Oh, there was another fortress in the northern part of Mordor, somewhere along the northern mountain range.

39:42ShareWell, I mean granted, I know the audience can't see this, but looking at the map you can see it's a horseshoe. Yeah, you can see Mordor's basically covered like a horseshoe.

39:49ShareTom:That's why Sauron shows yeah. So it's pretty it's protected on three sides by mountains.

39:55ShareYeah, just naturally that are impassable.

39:56ShareTom:That's pretty cool. Yeah, anyway, the mountains of Ash and the mountains of Shadow for those keeping score at home.

40:04ShareYeah, if you're listening to this, if you pull up a map, it's pretty interesting to see Like I mean especially for Tolkien to have had this all planned out as well not just the people with the terrain and everything.

40:14ShareTom:Exactly. It all makes sense in a way why everything happened as it did Frodo and Sam. They get well. Sam falls down the hill in front of the Black Gates of Mordor. Frodo falls and down there, uses the oven cloaks to shield them.

40:27ShareThat's one heck of a cloak.

40:29ShareTom:Yeah, they're about to just say, screw it. And make a mad dash into the Black Gates of Mordor and just hope for the best. Yeah, Golem stops them and tells them about the other way to get into Mordor, which is like there's another way, there's a tunnel, Like we can. We can still get in there. Yeah. So that's what leads them going through, because at this point they're here at the top, so that takes them through here, which is a Thillion, Okay, and that's where they meet, pharmaire.

40:55ShareAnd is the Pharmaire. That's the city that he's at. That's an old city of Gondor that's like ruined now.

41:01ShareTom:When they get to say that's Oskiliath, that used to be the capital of Gondor.

41:04ShareOkay, well, because they're running like they're hiding, as the big elephants and all the was it Easterlings are coming through, and then they all the men from like Harad yeah when Pharmaire attacks them, they catch the hobbits.

41:19ShareTom:Yeah, the ranges of a Thillion. Capture them and then they get brought to like the forbidden pool or cave, like their secret hideout. They're, they're, they're, they're lair. Yeah, the dudes hanging out. That's where they get interrogated. Barmaire reveals he's, or Pharmaire reveals his Barmaire's brother, and Frodo at. Sam at this point had no clue. Barmaire died.

41:41ShareOkay, they thought he was still alive, yeah.

41:43ShareTom:He explains that you know they found his brother's body because they heard in a Thillion the horn of Gondor.

41:50ShareOkay, oh yeah, I forgot. I forgot. That's supposed to be heard across the land.

41:52ShareTom:It's. It's a stout horn. Yeah, and Barmaire was that kind of guy had that deep lungs.

41:58ShareHe had those big boy lugs.

42:00ShareTom:Because Barmaire is in the book. He's a unit. What's that? He's a big dude. Okay, like he's. He's huge, because I think he's actually. He's not. I don't think he's as tall as Aragorn, but he's like twice as wide.

42:13ShareOkay.

42:14ShareTom:He's like six, five and just super strong.

42:18ShareSo he's like the mountain.

42:19ShareTom:Yeah, he's like the mountain. But not as like dumb, Whereas Aragorn's like he's more slender than him but he's taller. So Barmaire was was a G. And then you know they meet Pharmaire. Pharmaire learns that they have the ring and like he could take it if he wanted to. And then they go through, they make it to Oskiliath and Pharmaire eventually realizes like he quickly rebuffs the ring in the book.

42:50ShareBut for yeah, Pharmaire is more just.

42:52ShareTom:family with Barmaire had like the vision or whatever like the dream about, like you know, like the hour of doom's at hand and sealers bane has been found, seek the halfling, whatever, and that, like Pharmaire, had that dream like a couple of times.

43:05ShareOkay, barmaire had it once.

43:08ShareTom:So Pharmaire was more like he's more of a kinder person. Okay, against like the more warlike Barmaire.

43:17ShareAnd then, at the same time, that's when you see Aragorn like on his journey, trying to get back.

43:25ShareTom:So Aragorn, you know, revives himself. His horse finds him. It's the horse he freed earlier , yeah, which he spoke to in like Elvish.

43:34ShareAnd that's what I'm asking how did that, just speaking Elvish, just give you like magical ability or what Well, the horse is like he actually bought that horse in real life.

43:46ShareTom:Oh yeah. Him and that horse were like. They was like. They were like and several like you like, wherever they were filming, like in Wellington in New Zealand, like the cops would get like. Initially they'd be like there's a dude with shaggy hair walking around with a sword and it was Vigil Mortensen. Like he literally would just take the sword and just go around and it was like. It was like just to get used to moving with it. That's what he did. But the horse is like the training, like he bought the horse. He bought Liv Tyler her horse that she had in the beginning and they're like yeah, it's like there be nights like we were like where's Vigil's? Like not the hotel, it's like he's in the stable with the

44:15ShareTom:horse and like he was just sleeping next to the horse. Like him and that horse were tight.

44:20ShareHe was trying to be. That horse died not that long ago. Oh yeah, I was surprised it lived that long.

44:25ShareTom:Yeah, I mean he's a. He's a very good horse rider, he's a good horseman, but him and him and that horse had like a but just so, just speaking of, which has like a magical property to it, though, Animals are more receptive into like they. They I don't want to say they get it, but like, even like in the fellowship when Glorfindell tells the horse and Elvis what to do and the horse just goes for it. So it's like they understand Elvis.

44:53ShareOkay, and then also I meant to ask this earlier, when , when she's talking to airborn, what's a dune day, doing day Do ?

45:03ShareTom:you know, dan? Yeah, what is the day in Rangers? What's that? That's what they become. They became because I didn't know if I had to expect the name was special for a reason or so the fall of new manure, which was here, you had, like the nine ships, make it to middle earth. Now umbar, they're called, like the black new minorities, that was already a satellite, like colony of new manure before the fall of new manure. And then, during the fall of the manure, the faithful, led by a lend deal, you know a seal door and his brother and Ariane. They get a great win from Val, from Valinor, because they were faithful to alluvatar, they weren't sacrificing people, they weren't following Sauron, they didn't try to invade Amon.

45:45ShareTom:They get whisked away and a lend deal lands in the north and founds are, nor the northern kingdom, the seal door and an area on form, gondor, okay, and they ruled jointly at us Gileath .

45:58ShareGotcha Okay.

46:01ShareTom:So the when the are nor broke into three kingdoms and then subsequently just disappeared really from existence because of the witch King of Angmar and just years and plague Um. The Rangers were men of the West, they still had the lineage and they became the dunedain Rangers or the dunedine Rangers, okay, and everyone was like the 16th chief to the dunedain.

46:25ShareAnd so sorry. Getting back to the stuff in the movie, once Frodo and Sam have been captured by Faramere and like Sam's trying to convince Frodo to use the ring and just just once and just disappear, how are they both so like? Opposed to the ring, as far as like where everyone else easily corrupted, for the most part, Most people are easily corrupted by it, like men more so hobbits not as easily. Well, like even even some of the other hobbits are are pretty , you know, susceptible to it, but Sam and Frodo, sam especially seems to be like completely immune to it.

47:00ShareTom:Sam is like the only one in the book who doesn't care about the ring, like at all. Like he's the only one who freely gives it up.

47:09ShareWell, it's because I mean, as you see Frodo, he starts off really good and then, as the movies go, on. You see him getting more and more corrupted.

47:15ShareTom:Not you know, not my choice, but I mean even in the fellowship in the book Frodo, like when Gandalf comes back after Frodo had had the ring and had it, you know, hidden, or whatever Gandalf comes, grabs the envelope, throws it in the fire and Frodo panics. He's like what are you doing? He's like, get it out, well he. Frodo was already like it was clutching into Frodo.

47:34ShareWell, at that time, though, he didn't know what it was, and the closer he's getting the stronger it's getting.

47:38ShareTom:Yeah.

47:39ShareOkay.

47:39ShareTom:But Sam I mean Sam uses the ring he does In In the book.

47:44ShareYeah.

47:45ShareTom:Okay, in the two towers at the very end, because the timeline in two towers' book at the end versus Return of the King is different.

47:52ShareOkay, well, I mean, what's different about it?

47:55ShareTom:So two towers ends with Frodo captured and Sam's stuck outside the gates of Kyrithungle.

48:03ShareOh, okay.

48:04ShareTom:Like they already go through, like dealing with, like Shilab and like, Okay, All that in Gollum.

48:08ShareYeah, okay. So with you know, with Frodo and Sam and Gollum captured by Faramir, you know they have to, like, negotiate their way to freedom. Well, at this time you still have Legolas, gimli and Aragorn with King's Aid and at Helms Deep when they're like it dire straits, like they're arming their people and stuff. Where do the elves come from?

48:34ShareTom:So the elves aren't in the book? That doesn't happen.

48:37ShareI was going to say, because they just like show up.

48:39ShareTom:Yeah, and that's a movie decision, okay, which I mean in the movie it was cool. Yeah, I mean it's still cool. It's still cool, you know, and people who were like purest, like that never happened, they were never there and it's like it's true they weren't. But, you know, for the movie it's like you know, you could just have more Rohan guys and did it like that, but you stole a really cool fight scene.

48:57ShareWho was the leader for that Hall, dear and who's the leader of the company of elves?

49:01ShareTom:they meet when they get into Lothlorean.

49:04ShareWhere's Lothl? Oh is that.

49:06ShareTom:Well, they meet Galadriel in the KELBLM, Okay that's what I thought.

49:09ShareSo he's the leader of the basically the Woodland Elves at that area.

49:12ShareTom:Yeah.

49:12ShareOkay.

49:14ShareTom:But then Saruman, like you know, meet Grima, makes it to Isengard and he's like you, stink of horse. And he's like, you know, gandalf the Wise, like Gandalf the Fool, he's like going crazy about it. And then Grima comes in and he goes. There was three that followed the wizard, a man in Elfinadorf, and he's like the man he goes. Was he from Gunnagos? No, he's from the north. He goes. He thought he was one of the Dunedain Rangers, like he's like , his cloth was poor but it's like he bore a strange ring on his right hand. Yeah, I remember saying that he's like two serpents, one crowned in flames or one crowned in flowers, the other one devouring, and Saruman like pulls open the books and he's like flipping through, like doing library research.

49:50ShareTom:And he's like the ring of Barra here, son of a, yeah, like damn , because that ring is carried by the heirs of Elendil. Yeah, and from Elendil previous into the first age, yeah, I don't know if I remember, because Barra here was an elf Don't talk about that and he gave it to like their great, great, great, great. like first age awesome, like barren, awesome kind of dudes. Like dudes that, like you know, cut the Silmarill like out of Morgoth's crown while he was asleep, guys. Okay, so that's that ring. And he's like oh, again I'll think he's found a seal. There he goes Lime was broken years ago.

50:30ShareAnd it's like no, he's that guy. Well, fast forward to. You know when they start to get attacked and you know, was it a Saruman kind of shows this previously, but it's like Saruman the white wizard all this amazing power and resources , his plan comes down to using black powder, basically, yeah, and he's like. I just thought that was funny.

50:55ShareTom:Welcome to the modern age. So in the book it's different. It's not like they blew open the huge wall, like they blew like the great and made it under Okay, like they didn't take out the entire section, which is really I just found it funny that basically his plan was Because Saruman in the book he becomes Saruman. He doesn't become Saruman the way he changes his name in the fellowship to Saruman of many colors. Saruman of many colors. Like his robes shimmer like different colors, like it's like blue, purple, white, red, green and he actually makes his own ring of power. Sauron taught him how to do it.

51:30ShareOh, so how does he know how to do that?

51:31ShareTom:So he does that, and then he obviously builds a huge army inside of Isengard and sends all of it to Rohan.

51:39ShareYeah, Well, yeah, because they send them there and then he's basically left defenseless when they I mean, he still has the goblin, some posse, you know, but nothing.

51:48ShareTom:He's like border patrol hanging out, but the main bulk of his force is on its way to Helm's Deep. Well, because I remember like and Gandalf had already left and , you know, way from my coming first light on the fifth day at dawn looked to the east because he went to go find Erkan Brand.

52:06ShareYeah, Well, I remembered, like the, I forgot the servant's name for Saruman, but Grima. Yeah, he's like there's no force substantial enough to attack Helm's Deep, it's like. And then you, all of a sudden, you hear them outside.

52:17ShareTom:And I remember, beyond writing, thousands of Storm. The Keeper says like tens of thousands and he goes. But my Lord, there is no such force. And he walks out of the bag and they're all like. It's like yeah.

52:29ShareHow did he not know they were out there? Did you? You didn't pass them.

52:33ShareTom:You never looked out the window here. No, you didn't pass these guys. There's thousands of them, there's tens of thousands of them, and they're all just. You know, big dudes that tiny guys.

52:43ShareBut I do like they. They show I like when they're all getting ready to fight, like they're standing out there just chanting and whatever. But they got their bows drawn to the old man accidentally. Let's go.

52:52ShareTom:Yeah, he slips and he just chaos. The guy right the neck and everyone just like tells me the whole this fire in elvish Cuz he thought it was an elf that did it, cuz the shot was that accurate.

53:02ShareWell, I just like it like the creepy version of like the orcs just starting to get angry after it happened. That was pretty cool.

53:08ShareTom:He's. They did like a behind-the-scenes thing. I can't remember where I saw. It might have been on I show on TV, like when the movie was being made, but like they did like a whole thing. It was during the Super Bowl and it was like five minutes or like ten minutes of two towers. It hadn't come out yet. Every so we were mean, my brothers, like oh my god, and it was like right when, like they're fighting the war and it was like the coolest thing ever. But they do like a behind-the-scenes like thing where they were doing the filming for the Battle of Helms, deep and. Because in the movie doesn't and the book it doesn't, rain, in the movie it does. At the beginning it was like it was like rainy season.

53:39ShareTom:It just started raining and we were like screw it. And all guys like we were just dudes hanging out. It's like we were beating the crap out of each other all night for like three weeks.

53:48ShareI mean, the rain really sets the tone for the scene, like you mean it's, it's like off the metal, yeah, of their armors.

53:55ShareTom:It's like it's cool.

53:56ShareI mean, it sets the mood, because it's like you know , this is, this is a dire situation, and now it's raining, of all things because in the book the fight is more protracted. What do you mean?

54:06ShareTom:We're like they gain the wall. They did they. You know, the defenders sweep them off, they take it. They sweep them to take it a sweep. Okay, so it's a little more back and forth then they use blasting fire to get through Underneath the ball and appear behind the wall. Instead of the cool scene where they blow up the entire wall, air going gets yeeted, wakes up and there's, like you know already, the like the reserves of elves, yeah, and like Gimli comes flying down out of the air and just starts taking out as many people as you can and Then air going, like you know, charges into him, yeah, it's like awesome, love it, beautiful stuff. Because, like big battle scenes like that, that well done, no

54:42ShareTom:one had seen that Well, I mean, still you don't see that very often now. And these movies 22 years old and still looks great.

54:49ShareYeah, there's our few scenes that I've noticed, like with the 4k rendition. Yeah, when the hobbits are standing in front of other people. There's like a little Kind of like blurry edge around them. I mean it's nothing that's gonna.

55:00ShareTom:Just like their midgets. Yeah, wearing like prosthetic masks and stuff.

55:04ShareWell, I mean that there's some like well I know in Return of the King because I've watched ahead a little bit to get some stuff that I was working on, but, like you can see, like it's like a blurry edge around the blue ray ones like the first extent.

55:17ShareTom:If you just watch those like it's, it looks flawless. It looks great. The more quality you put into it, the you can see like that CG , like it's this, but I mean still still looks good, but overall it's still like.

55:33ShareBut yeah, so the so the orcs.

55:35ShareTom:They stormed the dyke . They managed to take the dyke outside of Helms deep. The defenders retreat into the fortress. You have the fight inside the fortress. They get behind the wall. They had to end up abandoning the wall and Hold up inside like the Hornberg and like the main part of the fortress. Yeah, where there's, you know, you have the causeway to get into it and then you have the stairs behind that lead up to it . Yeah, and for a while they wouldn't attack because airworms just standing there with on do a reel and like, literally, like the fear of that sword, they were like all right, no, you go first. No, you go. No, you go. No, I'm some the new guy. No, I'm okay.

56:12ShareWell, I do like when they're like holding the door up and then, uh, like in the beginning of our so like how long do you need? And then that's like the coolest scene of the entire movie.

56:20ShareTom:I love that scene so much and like he looks, it's just like there's a beat the crap out the door at the ramming cuz like come on, we can take him.

56:28ShareIt's like I love that and he's like not a word.

56:36ShareTom:As like some dorks, just like swinging a ram or standing on like, yeah, we're getting in there, holy crap, a dwarf. And then it's like air going to .

56:44ShareYeah, it's pretty cool. I like that also, like how airgord looks at him when he's like throw me, he's like are you serious?

56:54ShareTom:Like I remember what you said to me in Moria. You said nobody talks, it's worth.

57:01ShareBut yeah, I mean they have that, then they.

57:04ShareTom:There's a good scene in the books where, like the fight still going on, it's early and like into the morning and like there's kind of like a low and air going like stands on the par pit with his hand out, like in token of parlay, and he's talking like communicating with the orcs and like the Wild men or the whatever. And it's like you know, oh, like you know, we're the Eureka. They're giving like the whole. Yeah, it's like we're here to. You know, fetch the king from his hole and air goings like you know, catch you guys, just like you know. He's like he tells, basically tells him to leave, and then he threatens them with. Like you know. He's like come dawn, it's like not one of you will be spared.

57:40ShareTom:He's like none of you will be left alive to bring back tidings to the north. He's like you don't know how bad you effed up and then they start shooting arrows at him. He just gets down.

57:51ShareSo the orcs are telling an air gorn that.

57:54ShareTom:Ergorn's telling them that oh, okay. He's like the part or not, one of you will be spared.

57:59ShareWe will kill all of you here but that's kind of until Gandalf shows up. That's just kind of hearsay because, like they're not at that point.

58:05ShareTom:They were doing pretty good. Oh, they were at that point. They don't mean they. They made it to the main causeway into the front gates. They'd taken the wall, the deep in wall. They've taken the back part. They split the force where air mirror and Gimli gets separated from everybody along with like half a company of men and they're pushing the glittering caves and held in there.

58:26ShareOh, I was talking about the movie, though, like they weren't, they weren't doing that great movie.

58:30ShareTom:And the movie know that we're not doing good at all . It started out like yeah, all you, all the arrows, you know, all in the orcs are just like we got. We got crossbows and that's like we got explosives. We can't prepare for this fight .

58:42ShareSo does air mirror show up before Gandalf does?

58:44ShareTom:and a mirror already been there the entire time. Oh okay, so every was locked up in the dungeon when they freed fading from Saruman's hold. That's right, he'd been with him the entire time. So the force that Gandalf goes to find in the movie, he brings back a mirror and the Roe here in the books. He goes and gets Urkin brand, who was the commander of Helmsdeep, who was on another party doing something else with like a thousand men at arms. Okay who's just? They were just down about. So Gandalf went to go find them and get them the Helmsdeep immediately. Okay for the fight because they didn't know it was happening. So the scene, the movie, where, like I Mean similar in the books, where they're having the, the good fight and they

59:27ShareTom:eventually it's like it's over, like they're hewing men at the ground, like it's over, and then everyone's, like you know, ride out and meet them. Yeah and even say that I think is the one actually suggests it. It's like I'll ride out and meet them like they horse up. Yeah, it's like the coolest scene ever where he's like doing like the little spaces and like the orcs break through and everybody's like Swords come flying out From the game. We blow in the horn of Helmhammer and they just charge out like screw it, we're going out in style, because in the movie everybody's just like yeah , no, not as awesome as the charge the Roe. Here I'm in return of the king, almost there, that's. I live. I tear up watching that.

1:00:08ShareTom:I Died. I'm 30 years old, 31 in two months. I've been. I've been watching that scene since they have it 21 years. I've been watching that scene every freakin time when fading gives the speech.

1:00:22ShareDidn't know.

1:00:22ShareTom:You're just a little soul there at the battle of telling our fields like I start tearing up and when they charge in the music and I'm just like it is. It is the most epic scene of all time. Nothing is cooler, nothing is cooler.

1:00:39ShareOkay, so while they're charging out to fight them all, frodo and Sam, they're being that there was fear mirror and they're getting attacked by one of the ring. Rays and orcs at the was the ruined city still as Giliath.

1:00:52ShareTom:Yeah, they're still there with the because the orcs are at this point pretty much hold the eastern shore now the ring race that's close to him on like the flying beast that's the witch king in the I believe that is the witch king of anymore. Okay, that's the same one that flies over them, one that are in the dead marshes, right?

1:01:08ShareI figured that was the same one, at least in those two scenes, but I don't know if it was still the witch king or not.

1:01:12ShareTom:But uh, so Frodo goes the, you know, full retard.

1:01:16ShareIt walks up to it with the ring.

1:01:17ShareTom:Yeah, faramir shoots the fell beast in the stomach with the with an arrow to throw him off. Sam tackles him. Frodo draws the sword to try to kill Sam. Sam's like no, it's me Sam, it's your Sam. And he's like oh, what have I done?

1:01:32ShareIt's just Sam.

1:01:33ShareTom:It's just Sam At. You know, faramir. Basically he realizes the ring is entirely evil because it's just forcing Frodo to do stuff. Yeah, when it when it. You know, he can resist as long as he wants, but eventually it'll break him.

1:01:46ShareWell, because it seems like, other than maybe golem and Bilbo, frodo's had the most amount of time consecutively since then well, actually I think it golem has had the ring, I think, the longest time.

1:02:00ShareTom:Well, I think he had the ring longer than.

1:02:02ShareSarah. Well, I'm saying between golem and bilbo, frodo's the only one that's ever had it a significant amount of time.

1:02:08ShareTom:Well, bilbo did have a first. You know, bilbo had it for 60 years, yeah.

1:02:13ShareAnd then Frodo's only had it.

1:02:14ShareTom:No, frodo's had it for probably 18 years 18. Okay, but granted, when Bilbo had it, sauron wasn't in like getting into strength, into such strength that he was in this version right cool cuz he had at this point, I'd say recently. He had more recently been because, like when golem was tortured, he saw Sauron like he saw like his hand that was missing, one finger for where the ring was cut off, that didn't grow back yet. But like he physically sees him , pippin sees him in the Palantir. Like he sees like Sauron's eyes looking at him.

1:02:50ShareI thought he didn't have a physical body yet.

1:02:52ShareTom:In the books he does Okay and it's kind of ambiguous about it, but like a lot of people, like really he's still, he has a corpial form.

1:03:00ShareOkay, so he just doesn't leave.

1:03:01ShareTom:He's not the flaming vagina on the tower. That's what my mom said. She's like the fire vagina, the flaming vagina.

1:03:13ShareOkay, I think so. I didn't know in the books that he would when Garm is tortured.

1:03:16ShareTom:He's tortured by Sauron.

1:03:17ShareOkay.

1:03:18ShareTom:Who's like overseeing him, like staying there with, like questioning him and asking stuff? Pippin talks to Sauron directly in Return of the King In the book, in the book when they're in Eteros, and he takes the Palantir from Gandalf while he's sleeping, like he talks, like Sauron's talking to him. Okay. And he sees him Like he's like a flame. Then it was like the eye was looking at him and it's just like eyes like a cat, like you know, like read the flame, like you know fire red eyes and it's like you know, with a pit, like in the center of the eye, like any other guy is like in a window into nothingness Is how dark Sauron's eyes are.

1:03:54ShareBut so, farmer, eventually lets-.

1:03:56ShareTom:He releases them under forfeit of his life.

1:03:59ShareWhich I mean. Why is that a thing Cause?

1:04:01ShareTom:he's letting the ring go, cause Denitor's at this point. Okay. He's yeah, denitor's is dead. He's a steward of Gondor. Okay, he's already been. He was already a strong willed person. He was a great man originally, initially. But he had one of the Palantir. They had the Menace Tyrath Palantir.

1:04:23ShareOkay, but you don't see that in the movie, right?

1:04:25ShareTom:Not in, he's in the two towers.

1:04:27ShareWell, I'm saying you don't see the you see he has a Palantir.

1:04:30ShareTom:No, you don't see that he has it, but him like looking in the Palantir for knowledge or whatever Sauron had like shown images of like the fall of Gondor, Like he just basically slowly just kind of drove them towards the edge of like kind of just go-.

1:04:41ShareParanoia.

1:04:42ShareTom:Yeah, paranoia and going off the deep end into insanity.

1:04:47ShareSo, farmer, lets them go. And then that's when you have Gandalf with. The riders return, they defeat the orcs, well, they make them retreat into the woods.

1:04:56ShareTom:So at this point Mary and Pippin are witchery beard. They have the Entmute, which is the meeting of all the Ents. They talk very slow, it takes forever, it takes like five hours to say hello in Entish. They're going through all that Like the entire time. All these events are happening, like Aragorn Gandalf going to Edera's meeting, thayden Freeing Thayden going to Menace going to Helms, deep, frodo, the whole thing. Mary, pippin are still talking to Ents. That's in Fangorn. That's still happening. They eventually get convinced that they're not orcs. They add them to the list Like they're just like working knowledge list of all the peoples and races of Middle Earth that they know of for so long they don't want to fight

1:05:44ShareTom:Isengard, they don't want to fight at all. They're very pacifistic, or pacifist towards the entire thing. That's when Pippin has the idea he's like I'll take you to the borders, you know you can go back to wherever you guys are from. And it's like you know, come back and visit too. And Pippin's like take us this way. And, like the stroke of brilliance Pippin had was like take us out. And he's like I like it. It's a shortcut, because he takes them through Fangorn to where Saruman had already taken out like half the forest and that's the first time Treebeard sees it and knows about it and loses it and summons all of them . And it's like you know, we march on Isengard and basically all of a sudden a forest is walking at you.

1:06:25ShareTom:They see them they see the other trees, which are the Hurons, which are like smaller ones, more menacing. They don't talk, the way it's kind of described, but they wrap . He sees them rapidly moving towards Helms Deep and he's like where are they going? He's like their business is with the orcs, he's and Treebeard is like my business is with Isengard. And then, like they break the gates of Isengard, they rip the walls down, they break the dam, they flood Isengard and they basically like they're throwing boulders at Orthang which they couldn't break it, and they're just stuck there.

1:07:02ShareWell, I just like how , in Helms Deep, when the orcs were treating to the woods, you just see the tree start shaking and people screaming. You just hear.

1:07:10ShareTom:Like because in the theatrical version you don't know what happens, like they run , but like you don't know where they went. They don't show them going into the forest. They don't show them not in the theatrical.

1:07:19ShareOh well, sorry. In the extended version. Yes, so in the extended version .

1:07:22ShareTom:That's when you figure out that all that, the rest of the army, got taken out by trees.

1:07:25ShareWell, I like how Gandalf was like don't pursue, Just let them go.

1:07:29ShareTom:Just let that happen, let that happen, let that happen. Those trees are gonna get them.

1:07:35ShareEverybody just wait. The extended version is much better to watch.

1:07:37ShareTom:The extended versions are better. This is the only way it should be watched. I mean, we all saw theatrical versions because that's what came out, and then, when Eddie Steadicust came out, I was like no, it's better.

1:07:45ShareIt's like a whole other hour of footage.

1:07:48ShareTom:It's like at least half an hour of footage.

1:07:50ShareNo, it's about an hour. I think it was like two hours and 49 minutes, theatrical and then extended. It's like three hours and 39 minutes, yeah. Lord of the Rings. So it's like 50 extra minutes of footage. It's awesome, but you know so. Gandalf and them end up winning Fairmere. That's what we know. Yeah, they end up winning.

1:08:10ShareTom:So, Aragorn Fairmere, like, whatever they watch the orcs go into the woods, they're taken out by because the forest just showed up. There was no forest there the night before, oh really. I didn't know that At night the battle start. That was not there. Okay, when they let, they're like what, so put these trees? But the orcs just ran in. It's like they, literally they were afraid of the trees but they were afraid of, you know, the king and obviously all the men on horses and guys with swords. So they ran to the trees and the trees KOed them. Okay, so they're left there. Marion Pippin sees Isengard with the ends. That's funny. At the end, where they're like, they find, like all the food. And then they find the pipe weed and they're just like

1:08:51ShareTom:getting high and eating the tree bird's like.

1:08:53Sharelook at that.

1:08:53ShareTom:It's like what's going? On.

1:08:54ShareIt's like, and they're just like, and it's just like this could be a relative.

1:08:59ShareTom:It's like shh. And then Frodo and Sam escape from Oskiliath. Fairmere points them how to get out, like through, like a subterranean, like sewer style way to get out Gollum, because Frodo sort of betrayed him, or he thinks.

1:09:16ShareLetting him get captured.

1:09:17ShareTom:Yeah, having him captured by fair by Farmer and his men Basically reverts back to gollum and the dude. Like you know, we'll lead him to the tunnel, so you, she'll handle it, and then it cuts with that.

1:09:31ShareNow, at this point, how old is gollum? I mean cause he's older than he's several hundred years old I think that's what I thought, but I just just something.

1:09:39ShareTom:I was wondering and then like gollum, had the ring for like 500 years.

1:09:45ShareYeah, because he's you know he's older than Bilbo because he finds it right. He's like the next person to find after a seal door, right?

1:09:54ShareTom:No, sauron has it, loses it to a seal door. A seal door loses it to the river. Yeah, deagle finds it. Smeagol kills. Deagle takes the ring. Smeagol loses it. It goes to Bilbo. Bilbo gives it to Frodo. Frodo loses it briefly to Sam and then it goes back to Frodo. Frodo loses it in the fight to gollum, and then the rings destroyed.

1:10:19ShareWell, yeah, we'll get to that next movie, but, yeah, ok. Well, I mean, as far as, like the movie goes, it's got some of the. I mean even they hold up today the practical effects, like because CGI, you know it can come and go, but the practical effects are really good, like just looking at the orcs and like some of the because they did it. It's not all CG yeah it's just like the scene where they're like to, you know, want to eat Mary and Pippin, the facial expression stuff you get from, like the prosthetics I mean, it looks really good, it looks amazing. It still holds up.

1:10:49ShareTom:That's why it brings the power. It looks like dog crap, so is the hobbit, because they're all just CG. They're not there.

1:10:55ShareNow I have to say, the first CGI thing to me doesn't hold up Is the ints faces.

1:11:01ShareTom:They look, they look mechanical or they look you know treebeards looks the best Because obviously he's a point of he's a major character, whereas the other ones, like in the dislike, you see one and it's like you know they look kind of like.

1:11:14ShareI like the the. The characters themselves look fine, but when you see their faces they look very digital. Yeah for the for the ints, but that's the first thing I've noticed Like it doesn't quite hold up, as well as everything else.

1:11:24ShareTom:And it's probably just because they up the resolution.

1:11:26Shareso much I was watching like the 4K Ultra HD edition, so like the old edition like the Blu-ray one.

1:11:33ShareTom:Oh yeah, that one was like Perfect. Yeah, what questions did you have that I didn't actually answer?

1:11:38ShareWe went through all of them, as I was. Oh, we did. Yeah, I would ask you the questions as we were getting to those scenes and stuff.

1:11:42ShareTom:So you didn't check on that one. What is that one?

1:11:45ShareOh, I was asking, how long, how long Okay.

1:11:47ShareTom:I just want to make sure we covered all the bases. Yeah Well, that was it for this episode of entertain this about the two towers. We'll obviously be very, very be visiting Return of the King, yep, and that'll be two weeks from now, so we'll go next week.

1:11:59ShareWe'll have our punishment review and some movie and news reviews that we have.

1:12:03ShareTom:And then war zone tips and tricks and strategies and the current state of affairs for that game called Raven software. Drop the ball big time with the season one reloaded update.

1:12:13ShareIf you're listening to this right now, the war zone tips and tricks that we'll have will be released at the same time. So after you listen to this, go listen to that.

1:12:20ShareTom:Or just listen to that, just listen to something yeah, yeah Of ours, not of any.

1:12:25ShareAlso, if you're newer to our stuff, every Thursday I'm started to put out like our technically throwback episodes. They're like three and four years old now, so you know, check those out too.

1:12:34ShareTom:Check out what was current in 2021. You'll get to hear.

1:12:38ShareYou'll get to hear Hayden talking. You know, lose it.

1:12:41ShareTom:He's still here.

1:12:42ShareHe's here in memory. If we keep thinking about it but yeah, you know, check out our stuff coming out. We'll have you know things through social media. If you have some like recommendations of stuff you want to hear more about, I have us review. Just you know, let us know through social media and we'll keep up with that. That's all I got.

1:13:00ShareTom:And that's it for this episode. My name is Tom. With me I had Mitch and we'll catch you next time. Right out, right out For death and glory For Rohan, for your people. Your son is right. People in the theater would have did it too. Look to my coming at first light on the fifth day that door . Look to these. How is this the? Whole clip.

1:13:37ShareYes, yes, the horn of hell, hammer hand Shall sound in the deep One last time. Yes, let this be the hour.

1:13:57ShareTom:When we draw swords together, feldeeds awake, now for wrath, now for ruin. And the red door Sounds like you farting. Ha ha ha. That was a little off the pitch . It's in the episode where I came in. I'm going to be a little bit more serious. I'm going to be a little bit more serious.

1:14:22ShareI'm going to be a little bit more serious. I apologize. I apologize. I think I'm going to be the ones that need to be dead.